PasoVoice.Com :: A controversial subject about gait

caliber · Site Admin

Very controversial topic! with very good questions!

In my opinion is very clear! Lets start with the foundation of APF following to PFHOBA ! and lets bring it to today's!

Who didn't know that DON DANILO was a TROCHA horse then? The same way HOW MANY PEOPLE TODAY! KNOW THAT CORAL LACE comes from DON DANILO! that had achieved the highest merits in his modality TROCHA?

WHOS LYING??????????? Rolling Eyes

BigJ

It's bigger than that.

Today, we have a contingent in the USA blaming the roots of the problems with gait with all the countries of origin. In general is this really true? I think not. Not when the people who started APF and PFOBA knew what a paso fino was, what the modality was, and had control of the registry, judging, and training.

My speculation is while it is easy to say "we were fooled", my question is, "really"? Because when I had been introduced to the breed for only 4 years, had only rudimentary understanding of gait or the breed and I could tell the difference then my question is why could not anyone else? PFOBA was only 4 years only so who is really to blame.

Kerry W · Site Admin

Maybe the people who had the money to import horses, but didn't want to pay for the "best", when it came to gait? I don't know...good topic!

caliber · Site Admin

Kerry, maybe and maybe not!

But many of those people are no longer around, and I still see the promotional selling campaing in certain lines and very LITTLE IF ANY! education about the lines and breed in general!

I wonder what would happend if I will breed Coral Lace to Colombian mares?

BigJ

They might be smaller and reinforce his bloodlines. I do not believe a 14.1 hand horse consistently produced 15 hand horses...sorry but let's measure all the mare's heights and their offspring from other stallions before lending any validation. That's like me saying Pat, a 13.x horse bred to my 14.3 mare produced my 15 hand stallion. Nope don't think so. Not when every horse the mare produced was at least 14.3 and not when I've seen smaller horses from Pat out of other mares. However, it is not just Coral that I am thinking about.

EDIT: I rambled on here, but here's the crux of it all: When did the fooled become the foolers. What purpose did that serve? When does the first generation fooler become less influential or will the first fooler always be responsible for the ills of the 2, 3 4, 5....generation of fools?

Also, I'm not entirely in disagreement with Kerry's thoughts, but...

Even if the "best" were not purchased some animals did have the genetics and gait. The question is what was promoted by the foundation breeders, trainers, and judges and why. I believe this is the real root of today's problem with PFHA. I've witnessed allot of energy expended to protect a farm's pocketbook instead of the breed. The "versus" arugment: XXXX vs. YYYY is an old dodging technique to shove the responsibility for the woes of PFHA onto others not present, not active, not part of the development of the breed or organization.

Rather than admit one was taken to the cleaners, there was a collective decision to hide the fact and then pass it down to the next generation of buyers and then blame it all on Colombia or Puerto Rico. A sweet deal when how many of them actually gave notice to Colombia or Puerto Rico of their accusations. Great when there is no defense.

So, I ask again, hoping to engage those accused to provide their defense. If PFHA is having problems with quality production, with gait, with training, with judging, then why is that? When I'm told again and again about all of the Latinos who helped create PFOBA, who were supposedly from generational breeders and trainers in their own countries, I have to ask why are we having problems now? What happened?

For instance, let's talk about pintos: Has anyone seen a pure Colombian pinto? Were Puerto Rican pintos routinely registered? If Colombians and Puerto Ricans were influential with all that is PFHA now then how did this happen? Do we really believe the Latinos influenced the registration of pintos? I don't.

Interesting too, that pintos are not a "problem" in PFHA's eyes. No sir. It is for many Latinos but not for gringos. Isn't that a hoot? If PFHA was really all about trying to cleanup the gait issue, why isn't it involved in the color issue and the bloodline issue such as Coral, Juan Juan and others. If the reason our horses are having problems is because we started off on the wrong foot why didn't the Americans straighten it up. It's been 36 years now. Plenty of time to fix it.

If I make bad chocies do I pretend that I didn't, sell a subpar product, act like it's not my fault or do I take my losses, chaulk it up to a learning experience and try to do better? That's what I'm getting at. Do I hold a grudge against a culture or country for being screwed by one individual or do I blame the individual?

Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me...and so how many times has PFHA been fooled? Look at the officer roster and judge roster in PFHA and tell me how these folks were fooled over and over and over again. If I were that adamant about getting the breed in a better position, I'd go to PR or COL and get trained or pay for a PR or COL to come to the USA and train us. Did that happen? Why not? Didn't Colombia or Puerto Rico care about what was going on?

On a final note. We can stop this now. If I had to pay $45 for something it would not be for a magazine that is worth dog piddle. I'd contribute even more to attend a clinic to listen to the breeder of Dan Danilo or have the owner of Labriego talk about production or history or something that would propel me further into the breed.

When I attend those Judges and Stewards clinic, see who attends and why...I no longer wonder why we have the problems we have. When this is the only clinic and offered only once in one location, then I understand. When the best presentations are from PR and COL speakers, I realize that in 36 years there has been little progression in this country with our breeders and our trainers.

caliber · Site Admin

So! we became traders instead of breeders! We promote a market instead of the breed! And our passion is the DOLLAR instead of the horse, that part has been clear. Maybe that is the true intention of the PFHA?

I still see it on a daily basis, specially POSTS from the other pasofinoS Forum how some people in this industry are trying to manipulate their product! (IS SICK) by pushing their DISHONEST thoughts on others.

You have a great POINT! I wonder who was the first PINTO breeder in this country?

BigJ

Hard to say but if I had to make a bet it would be Fred Green or Randilyn Scott. Scott/Lugo did get a pinto registered into the PR Federation stud book. If you look at the pintos bred by Greener Pastures, some were from Fred Green originally.

Stephens brought up their own pinto stock, but after Green and Scott.

Then there's the problem of pinto breeders wanna bes trying to say a sabino is pinto, that they are one and the same. Not hardly. Not when in PR the distinction was VERY clear what was pinto and what was sabino. Again, even I knew the difference as a youngster. Yet, we have adults years in the paso fino breed that can't figure it out. They still have a hard hold on the idea that anything with white above the knees or hocks and a bald face is "pinto".